We're blessed with polls right before 10/7 re: "Support for Hamas." Roughly 40/60. I've seen other junk ones passed around. I don't think 10/7 or what we ended up with in Gaza was justified, a sweeping international majority agrees, and both Israel/Gaza will poll at "of course it was justified and why are people so evil as to not support us"
You transmutated "I've never seen any jokes about WCK" to "the only thing I've ever seen is links about polls" to "linking to polls isn't bad.": sure, no one would say it is. so it comes across as an attempt to claim it is unreasonable to claim that worse things go on than linking to polls.**
> has a vested interest in perpetuating the "refugee" status of millions of Palestinians who were born outside Israel
I'm familiar with this argument: sure. If that's the case, let's get rid of the UN. We'll have to find some way to get not-terrorists governing Gaza, i.e. providing for the people.
There's two choices from there.*
In my experience, one of them is consistently ruled out by people who spend time litigating the UN. And I strongly believe that is where the breaking point in international support is.
* if you exclude "kick the can down the road" and "the Palestineans without the guns should seize power from the guys with the guns, otherwise they're complicit"
**
It's just a feeling, but one informed by 1000 conversations I've had: if the strawman about poll links means "yeah, I've seen racism, but justified and rational, because the polls say a majority of Them" -- I think that's exactly the class of behavior that leads me to be a proud Zionist, it's dangerous to proscribe beliefs to a group, based on location of their housing, religion, skin color, anything. It justifies some very ugly things.
You transmutated "I've never seen any jokes about WCK" to "the only thing I've ever seen is links about polls" to "linking to polls isn't bad.": sure, no one would say it is. so it comes across as an attempt to claim it is unreasonable to claim that worse things go on than linking to polls.**
> has a vested interest in perpetuating the "refugee" status of millions of Palestinians who were born outside Israel
I'm familiar with this argument: sure. If that's the case, let's get rid of the UN. We'll have to find some way to get not-terrorists governing Gaza, i.e. providing for the people.
There's two choices from there.*
In my experience, one of them is consistently ruled out by people who spend time litigating the UN. And I strongly believe that is where the breaking point in international support is.
* if you exclude "kick the can down the road" and "the Palestineans without the guns should seize power from the guys with the guns, otherwise they're complicit"
** It's just a feeling, but one informed by 1000 conversations I've had: if the strawman about poll links means "yeah, I've seen racism, but justified and rational, because the polls say a majority of Them" -- I think that's exactly the class of behavior that leads me to be a proud Zionist, it's dangerous to proscribe beliefs to a group, based on location of their housing, religion, skin color, anything. It justifies some very ugly things.